Urgent help with Absolute Black prefeb blanks

[Tac]

Urgent help with Absolute Balck prefab slab

Hello
Im using Absolute Black prefeb slabs. The supplier says they are from India but they are probably from china. They carry lost of stock of Ab Black, Star Galaxy, Baltic Brown, Black pearl,  blue pearl, emerald pearl,  steel grey, and the black and white quartz with the silver flecks which they give their own name. All the above are all prefab blanks.
Ive used this supplier before but only for star galaxy and i did not have any problems.
Im doing a very basic install, its just 3 separate lengths of granite. It just needs cutting to length, the edges polishing and the corners rounded over. I have cut it all to length and rounded the corners but ive come into trouble with the polishing.

The blanks come with a flat edge polished on all 4 edges. The colour on the top of the slab and on the polished edges is consistent and is very dark and shiny. When i polish the cut piece of granite i can get it to shine, but the colour does not match the top and the factory polished edges. The factory edges are very dark, but mine are not as black and seem to have sort of a green tint and you can sort of see some crystals which are sort of colourless/transparent or maybe whiteish/green? Its hard to explain exactly what i mean.  My polished edge is nowhere near as dark or black as the factory edge and the factor edge does not have these crystal things showing at all. If i take the factory edge back down to 50grit and polish it back up again these crystal things show through and the colour is lighter. Ive even treid waxing the edges with black wax and then buffing it off with a buffing pad but it doesn’t help.
It s not really acceptable but it would not be as noticeable if it was just on the cut edge which is along the width, but because i have rounded over the front corners the polish blends into the front edge and it is very noticeable because it does not match the rest of the factory front edge. The quality of the shine on my edges is also not as shiny as on the factory edge. The only thing i can think of doing is to repolish all the edges so they match each other but they wont match the top. This still isn’t acceptable but at least all the edges will match.
Ive read alot about prefab blanks and especially the blacks and how they can be doctored at the manufacturers in china/india. Does this stone sound like it is died or doctored or am i doing something wrong? Is it only the Absolute Black that seems to get doctored or can Star galaxy be doctored too?
Im using ADT dry pads. I have tried polishing the edge both dry and wet with these pads and it doesn’t make a difference. I think its the actual stone but id like to know if it could be me. I don’t have any other pads to try but i can pick some new ones up locally tomorrow if i need to. Does this problem sound like it could either be the pads or my polishing technique?

Im going to call the suppliers in the morning. I need to get this sorted asap. I will see what the supplier has to say regarding the stone. If they will let me, I am willing to take the slabs back to the suppliers and see if they can get the edges to polish and match the factory polish. The supplier does supply and fit worktops so there should be somebody on hand to polish them.
I don’t want to take them back to the suppliers if its something im doing wrong with the polishing technique or the polishing pads. I think its the stone but id like some advice.

[Tac]

I dont have any acetone but ive tried the misses nail polish remover which contains some acetone. I put it on the polished factory edge but it didnt seem to take any die off as its suposed to on died stone. Im not sure on the amount of acetone in the nail polish remover but its probably not enough.

[Mark D.]

First of all the stone is probably dyes. Not uncommon. If when it is wet the lighter edge matches use a color enhancer on the lighter part only. If when the lighter edge is wet and it is still noticeably lighter then you should use a dye like Uniblack to fix the problem.
You might try polishing with a better quality pad. ADT is one of the cheapest pads available but you usually get what you pay for, and a dry resin pad on black stone is usually asking for a poor finish in my opinion.
If you must polish dry go to a better quality ceramic bonded pad but I would rather polish it wet. Much easier to match the gloss in much less time.
Here are 2 links for Uniblack 1 & 2 which were designed for dealing with doctored AB:
http://www.defusco.com/Tenax-Uniblack-Stain
http://www.defusco.com/Tenax-Uniblack-Liquid-Wax

Glad to be of service,
Mark

[Tac]

when its wet it still doesnt match the factory edge.
when the fully polished edge is wet the crystals or what ever they are still show through.
when an edge that is polished to 100-200grit is wet you can clearly see these crystals.

i dont think i can get that tenax locally and i could do with sorting this straight away.
when so you apply the tenax step 1 and 2? is it done after its polished?

i have used these adt pads both dry and wet but it still doesnt help.
i understand that you get what you pay for. could it be the pads that are cousing a problem and would better quality pads fix the problem without the tenax?

[Mark D.]

We can get it shipped to you right away. The ADT pads as well as the other dry resin pads (even ours) just don't give you the polish on black stones.
Mark

[Tac]

Thanks for your help Mark

Is this common with Absolute black and is most of the ab black on the market like this?
will the tenax wear off?

It looks like i need the tenax uniblack and some better pads.
Ill be ordering some more stuff from your site too, however im not from the USA so shipping times will be too long for this to arrive quickly.

Ill take a trip to my local granite tool suppliers which is only about a mile or two from my house. They are expensive but only round the corner if you need something. Ill see if they stock tenax or a similar product. I will also call the stone supplier and see if they stock anyting to darken the stone.

Which dry pads that you stock would you recommend that are good quality for polishing wet and which pads for polishing dry? Or do you do a set that you recommend that can be used both wet and dry that are good quality.

[Mark D.]

There is some bad AB coming in from China and India that is dyes because it is light. It is light because there is too much calcium in the stone from what I understand. This leads to problems with it etching also. AB is usually basalt, not granite. It is not typical of all AB, but there are some bad lots of it.

Uniblack 1 is a dye and unitblack 2 is like a liquid wax. I say "like" because Tenax makes it and they say it is not a wax.
What city and country are you in? I may be able to help find you a dealer.

Glad to be of service,
Mark

[Tac]

hi mark ive sent you a pm.

also, if Akemi do a similar product my local supplier stocks their stuff but not Tenax

[Tac]

Here is a link to 2 photos i have taken
The first is a picture (dsc01523) of 3 edges. The two on the ends are the factory edge and as you can see its dark black, the one in the middle is mine. Its not as black and also shows sort of white specs. I don’t think this is burnt is it?

The 2nd picture (dsc01524) is polished to either  100 or 200 grit (cant remember). I have wet a section on the bottom slab and it clearly shows a set of crystals in the middle of the wet part. This is showing through right at 100grit and when fully polished it still there. Is this burnt stone or is it actually inside the stone?
http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/7382/dsc01523g.jpg

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/2573/dsc01524u.jpg

Ive spoken to the supplier. They passed me onto a fabricator. He said they polish it dry, quicly and don’t even use a buff pad. They apply a black dye at the 3000 grit stage and then apply a black wax and buff it off. The dye they use is a black colouring for polyester/epoxy. Im off to get some from the local supplier, ill let you know how it goes.

Can people comment on the pictures, sorry they are not the best quality. Does it look like it me doing something wrong or is it the actual stone?

[Mark D.]

It looks like dyed stone. I can't tell about the gloss but this is fixable.
Mark

[Tac]

i agree now about it being dyed.
got a new set of wet pads and cut and polished a new flat edge with all waterfed tools.
better shine but still not the correct colour and grey bits showing through.

ive tried applying some epoxy colouring dye then buffing it off, then some black wax but its not worked.

is the tenax uniblack applied after its fully polished, or it applied on a lower grit and then polished up?

my idea is to repolish all edges so they will all match each other but not as dark as the top.
i can then install it and if its still a problem i can order the tenax from you and apply it to the edges while its already installed. i cant do this however if it will need repolishing after the tenax because i would have to remove the tops.

so at what stage is the tenax applied?

[Mark D.]

I would use the Uniblack (or any dye) in the middle of the polishing process and then again at the end of the polishing process.
You can get an oil based Minwax black dye there and try it on some scraps to see if you like the color. I do not like using wax on a food preparation area.

Glad to be of service,
Mark

[Tac]

just another quick update.
i sent the supplier some more detailed pictures.

i have repolished with brand new wet pads and id say my shine is better than the factory. the problem is the colour and the grey patches. there is also a hint of green coming through i think.

i spoke to a fabricator and the owner of the suppliers.
the fabricator says i havent died the stone properly or not polished it properly.
there is nothing wrong with the polish so its obviously how im dying it wrong?

they said you have to apply a black dye which is used to colour epoxy. they gave me the part no for this. then apply black wax, then apply the dye again. if its not working they said its me who is doing it wrong and have offered to let me go into their place in the morning and they will polish a section of my stone and dye it for me so i know how to do it!

i told them that you should not have to apply dye or wax and its the true colour of the stone showing through. they basically said i dont know what im talking about and were not up for arguing.

ive done a bit more testing on the stone. if i just polish the factory edge only a little the black starts to go and out comes the same colour and grey cyrstals as my edge. if you look closely in a few sections of the fatory edge you can actually see through the dye and see the crystals and grey spots. its very hard to see though and you have to get it in the correct light and look hard to see through the factory edge.

its clearly the stone but i wasnt sure at first.
ill have to hang this one up as experiance

this is actually from a nation wide supplier (not naming any names though) who supply and fit a lot of granite. they have quite a big yard and im assuming sell a lot of stuff. their price was not especially cheap but most other suppliers are out of stock on the ab black.

[ilovegranite]

This granite does not look like absolute black granite to me. It actually looks a little like zimbabwe black or even G654 dark, from China, but it could be the photos. Usually it is unscrupulous suppliers who dye thier stone, not large reputable suppliers, maybe you should talk to them and if they did not mention it was dyed then maybe they can refund some of you money. Black granites that have been dyed cost much less than genuine absolute blacks such as Shanxi black from China - the highest quality black in the world in my humble opinion.

[Stone Dude]

Im using Absolute Black prefeb slabs.

This is the problem.


it looks like BA to me, but it could be anything. just because its dyed or has calcium does not mean it isnt BA. unfortunately no one knows where most the prefabs come from. we dont touch prefabs and we dont have this problem.